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Blood Royal
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PostPosted: Thu 17 Oct - 01:49 (2013)    Post subject: Casus Belli Types Reply with quote

Alright, managed to decipher the casus belli document, and made some changes.

Middle-Earth was a little too quiet for my liking, so the following changes were made:

1, Religions Melkor, Orkish, Black_Numenorean and Southron now have invasion CBs on all neighboring kingdoms as long as they are not the same religion. They also get a casus belli on a kingdom if they have just one province in it. It costs 50 piety, and the truce is 10 years. (I reduced the piety from 500 because Mordor only makes 1 piety per month - we can easily change this piety requirement later). I used the muslim_invasion CB for this.

2. Dunedain, Calaquendi, Moriquendi, Mahal, and Rhovanion have casus belli with same conditions and cost (50 piety) on the evil religions: Melkor, Orkish, southron, easterling, and black numenorean. I copy/pasted the muslim invasion, modified it, and called it muslim_invasion2 in the document.

3. Easterling and Southron religion both get the "tribal invasion" and "pagan subjugation" casus belli - the tribal invasion I think lets one attack a province even if it is not adjacent, in my test game as a southron I could for example claim the kingdom of mordor even though I had no border with it. This especially we will need to test, to see if it is misused.

This is not tested at all (except to see if it works as intended, which it does), but it might be fun to include it in the next build Twisted Evil

http://www.sendspace.com/file/7sa2r4
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PostPosted: Thu 17 Oct - 01:49 (2013)    Post subject: Publicité

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Chris93
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PostPosted: Thu 17 Oct - 08:03 (2013)    Post subject: Casus Belli Types Reply with quote

You are doing a huge work. Impressive Wink
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Blood Royal
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PostPosted: Thu 17 Oct - 14:51 (2013)    Post subject: Casus Belli Types Reply with quote

Okay The 100 year simulation I ran actually works quite well. Harad conquers most of the tribal south quite quickly, though it took them 100 years to take Umbar. Khand is a buffer-state between a super-Harad and a super-Rhun. Rhun doesn't take Dale or Mirkwood, Rohan sits still, and Gondor took Ithilien and Harondor. Mirkwood took Dol Guldur from Mordor, and in Eriador pretty much nothing happened.

Lesson so far is that Mordor is under-powered, and shouldn't be attacked by Harad (they tried to take Harondor at some point too, but failed). Msybe we can change the cultural files so that levy sizes are increased for Mordor and Isengard (orcs/uruks)?

Which reminds me, I didn't include Isengard in these Casus Belli, the Uruk religion needs to have the same CB types as the Orcs. Will post an update later.
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Lonhaldar
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PostPosted: Thu 17 Oct - 14:54 (2013)    Post subject: Casus Belli Types Reply with quote

Ok looks fine!
But it seems that the wilderness conquest doesn't works with elves, and Aragorn played by IA doesn't attack any county, even with his 2 casus belli ("heir of Isildur Claim" an "Wilderness Conquest").
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Blood Royal
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PostPosted: Thu 17 Oct - 14:57 (2013)    Post subject: Casus Belli Types Reply with quote

I had ONE game where Aragorn was on his way to conquering the North. I think the problem is that with all provinces fully upgraded, the odds of one Aragorn province successfully conquering another fully upgraded wilderness one is very low. Once he had two provinces, however, he started expanding quite well. So let's give him some more provinces, then he should be able to use his CB on the wilderness.

And was Wilderness conquest supposed to work with elves? I thought it was intentional that elves and dwarves weren't meant to expand their realms, leaving room for the Dunedain of the North to do so. If they are supposed to be able to use it, however, I can fix that easily enough I think.
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Lonhaldar
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PostPosted: Thu 17 Oct - 15:00 (2013)    Post subject: Casus Belli Types Reply with quote

Yeah you're right, elves and dwarves shouldn't have it, but it appears as CB for these characters (even if they're lacking some conditions).


For Aragorn, it could be resolve when we'll adds more dunedain in the map, they'll all be under the "chief of the dunedain" leadership !
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Blood Royal
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PostPosted: Thu 17 Oct - 15:34 (2013)    Post subject: Casus Belli Types Reply with quote

Updated version which is fixed so that religion_uruk is included:

http://www.sendspace.com/file/q9y2v0
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Lonhaldar
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PostPosted: Thu 17 Oct - 15:36 (2013)    Post subject: Casus Belli Types Reply with quote

Ok perfect, i includes all this stuff in my build, the 0.2c will come at the beginning of the next week i think!
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Nukumnehtar
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PostPosted: Thu 17 Oct - 16:03 (2013)    Post subject: Casus Belli Types Reply with quote

Blood Royal wrote:
I had ONE game where Aragorn was on his way to conquering the North. I think the problem is that with all provinces fully upgraded, the odds of one Aragorn province successfully conquering another fully upgraded wilderness one is very low. Once he had two provinces, however, he started expanding quite well. So let's give him some more provinces, then he should be able to use his CB on the wilderness.

And was Wilderness conquest supposed to work with elves? I thought it was intentional that elves and dwarves weren't meant to expand their realms, leaving room for the Dunedain of the North to do so. If they are supposed to be able to use it, however, I can fix that easily enough I think.


The Elves should probably only be allowed to expand in their de jure territory: i.e. Eregion for the Elves of Imladris, and South Mirkwood for the Elves of Lorien and Mirkwood. Also perhaps given a province or two in North Ithilien to simulate Legolas' realm there after war of the Ring.
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Lonhaldar
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PostPosted: Thu 17 Oct - 16:04 (2013)    Post subject: Casus Belli Types Reply with quote

Yeah, we could use the same mechanic than the "Heir of Isildur Claim" casus belli for Eregion i think!
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Blood Royal
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PostPosted: Thu 17 Oct - 16:45 (2013)    Post subject: Casus Belli Types Reply with quote

 I agree, Elrond at least has a very clear de_jure claim on Eregion - or if not him, then we can make a character in his court that has a claim, which Elrond could then help press.

That might be more realistic, since Elrond was never really in Eregion, but many of the most powerful elves that still live in Imladris definitely were.

I'm all for giving it to Elrond directly as well, however, as long as Imladris can expand into Eregion, I'm happy enough!
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Lonhaldar
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PostPosted: Thu 17 Oct - 16:47 (2013)    Post subject: Casus Belli Types Reply with quote

Yeah, i'm for giving it to Elrond directly too. But maybe some princes (Gildor, Glorfindel, ...) could have some claims too?
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Chris93
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PostPosted: Sat 2 Nov - 09:02 (2013)    Post subject: Casus Belli Types Reply with quote

Can Casus bellis be restricted by culture? I suppose they can
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Lonhaldar
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PostPosted: Sat 2 Nov - 11:29 (2013)    Post subject: Casus Belli Types Reply with quote

Yeah, we can adds the same conditions for events i think. So cultural, religious restrictions are able!
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Chris93
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PostPosted: Sat 2 Nov - 11:36 (2013)    Post subject: Casus Belli Types Reply with quote

Good news. I asked this because I was thinking that the dark races (uruks/goblin/orcs) etc. shouldn't be allowed to use some casus belli's like "war agains the tiranny of..." "war to change succession laws in..." etc... I don't think they fit very well with orks and similar, and would ruin the empathy...
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